HERETIC ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Friday, December 08, 2006

Was a physical resurrection EVER promised?

Hey y'all,
A thought just occured to me, that may have already occured to many of you; is Daniel 12:2 necessarily speaking of a 'physical' resurrection?
Genesis 2:7 says that "God formed man of the dust of the ground".

Daniel 12:2 says that "many who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake...."

Now, I will admit that in alot of cases, most in the NT, 'sleep' or 'sleeping' refers to physical death; I think, in particular, of John 11:11, where Jesus told His disciples that Lazarus was 'merely' sleeping, and that He was going to 'wake' him up! ( this has interesting connotations concerning God's Eternal Plan, and what 'death' and 'life' really connote! )

I Corinthians 15:34 tells us to "awake to righteousness. ..."

Earlier, in the book of Romans, Paul reminds his readers that "now it is high time to awake out of sleep..........."

Paul told his readers, in I Thessalonians 5:6, "Therefore, let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober" strongly implying that sleep or sleeping does'nt always refer to physical death, but to those who are not watching as they should!

This is by no means a comprehensive, nor maybe eve conclusive list, but it should raise some question in your minds ( if the question was not there already ) as to whether a 'physical' resurrection was EVER promised to Israel!

I think we would all agree that we cannot 'wake' ourselves ( much less, to righteousness ): so, do you think that what was promised in Daniel 12 was 'merely' a promise of his ( Daniel's ) people 'waking' to their Righteousness? What do you think?

being a Berean,
in Christ,
Charles Shank


Daniel Stoddart said...

Hey Charles.

I Cor. 15:24: Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

The whole context of the passage, culminating in v. 26 ("The last enemy that will be abolished is death.")

So I've never had any reason to think it was about anything else but death, let alone sleep (allowing, as you do, that sleep in the NT is a common synonym for death).

Charles Shank said...

You've never had any reason to thinki that what was about deatth; I Corinthians 15, Dan iel 12:2, or the resurrection, or all three?

( allowing as I do, that'sleep' is SOMETIMES synonymous with 'death' ! )

Anonymous said...

Is eternal life "post physical death" or does it begin at conversion or earlier?
If it does not begin after physical death, then I don't see that eternal life or eternal death has anything to do with the physical bodies we have.
Except that what we do in the body now shows where we reside in the spirit.

Charles Shank said...

This could bring u a whole other discussion, but what if I say that eternal life began at conception, or earlier?

Anonymous said...

Going under the assumption that "life" is concious exsistance, I would say that "eternal life" couldn't begin before conception. However I do believe that I was ordained to eternal life from the beginning.
Irreguardless, If I have the new creation, nothing else is necessary. If I do not, nothing else will suffice.
HHHMMMMmmm. Our "old" self must die to recieve eternal life, so I still say that eternal life can't begin before conception.
I could be wrong. (It's been known to happen, believe it or not)

Charles Shank said...

When I questioned whether eternal 'life' could have had its beginnings earlier than conception; I had in mind the idea of the election 'before the foundation of the world'. On a purely 'physical' plane though, I guess we WOULD have to say that eternal life begins at conversion, for, as Paul said, "the body is dead because of sin"!

Anonymous said...

What if our first death actually begins at our birth or at the age of 12 according to scripture? IMHO we start to die as soon as we are born of this world. There are many references in the Old Testament that guide my belief that life and death are spiritual not physical. Job is a perfect example of this spiritual connotation. Job 26:5 Dead things are formed from under the waters, and the inhabitants thereof.6 Hell is naked before him, and destruction hath no covering. Maybe, just maybe Adam & Eve were spiritually naked? Maybe, just maybe, they stopped dying spiritually even though physically their bodies died. I choose to believe that God is spiritual and His word is speaking to us spiritually, not physically and this is why the world that is lost from God will remain in the world (dead). By Reesa Mercer Walsh

Charles Shank said...

I have always believed, though I have not practiced it so well, that the physical is representative of the spiritual, the true being!

Biologically, our bodies do begin to die the minute we are born, they are designed that way!

Spiritually, we are 'born', are awakened when the Holy /Spirit of God enters into us, and we become His!